Mass Edit - Daniel Krieger and other SST "aliases"

I proposed in the runout groove thread that the alias for Daniel Krieger, https://www.discogs.sie.com/forum/thread/743281?page=21#7648137

I went there before making a full on "Mass Edit" post to see if there was any point of going forward, and all comments there were in agreement that a change was needed.

It seems the use of aliases for these SST engineers could have came about from the use of an alias for SST (8) = Christa Brüggemann, but that's just my thinking.

This change to an ANV would include the following engineers:

SST TK -> Theo Krieger

This would also need to be changed in various label profiles for SST GmbH.

It is not a small change, there are 2,593 credits linked to the alias of Daniel Krieger alone.

Pings...

sebfact

leeving
This would also need to be changed in various label profiles for SST Brüggemann GmbH and SST GmbH.

If you're about to update 2.5 k SST related credits might as well re-think the whole SST thing and consider changing those company credits to what's actually listed on releases ie SST instead of those full GmbH names that create problems when the name change is unknown to the vast majority of s or plain guesswork for all those early 2017 releases that no one knows if they were cut in mid' October 2016 or late November.

SST signature in runouts = SST credit, and the legal / incorporation timeline should be profile info.
See related thread @ https://www.discogs.sie.com/forum/thread/771540

I think the "K SST" ANV was from back in the days we didn't had company credits, and this was a common way to list the runout credits. Tricky part is that on some release, there's almost a quarter of a disc between the K and the SST

You can get my +1 on the reasoning for K SST, SST AL etc., though what should we do with Christa herself, and just the plain SST-credit? Applying the same logic as the other SST-cutters, her credit would in fact disappear (since SST would only link to the company) Or do you propose to keep the current SST (8) profile for Christa?

_jules
If you're about to update 2.5 k SST related credits might as well re-think the whole SST thing and consider changing those company credits to what's actually listed on releases ie SST instead of those full GmbH names that create problems when the name change is unknown to the vast majority of s or plain guesswork for all those early 2017 releases that no one knows if they were cut in mid' October 2016 or late November.

Agreed, we should get agreement on that topic as well before initiating any edits.

_jules
leevingThis would also need to be changed in various label profiles for SST Brüggemann GmbH and SST GmbH.

If you're about to update 2.5 k SST related credits might as well re-think the whole SST thing and consider changing those company credits to what's actually listed on releases ie SST instead of those full GmbH names that create problems when the name change is unknown to the vast majority of s or plain guesswork for all those early 2017 releases that no one knows if they were cut in mid' October 2016 or late November.

SST signature in runouts = SST credit, and the legal / incorporation timeline should be profile info.
See related thread @ https://www.discogs.sie.com/forum/thread/771540

All that was discussed and decided 4 months ago...

https://www.discogs.sie.com/forum/thread/761344#7548615

leeving
All that was discussed and decided 4 months ago...

https://www.discogs.sie.com/forum/thread/761344#7548615

Good to know. Perhaps a link to those discussions could be added when updates are done @ https://www.discogs.sie.com/release/11409928-The-Essen-Jazz-Festival-Concert/history?diff=12&page=1 ?
That would help understand where those decisions or rather random Needs changes votes such as https://www.discogs.sie.com/release/9735542-A-Very-Nice-Combinado-Volume-Dos/history#latest are coming from...

Still problematic to have GmbH entities credited based on SST signatures, IMO, especially when the switch from one to the next cannot be determined.

That is still a whole other discussion, this is about changing the aliases to ANV's

leeving
This change to an ANV would include the following engineers:

Agreed.

_jules
SST signature in runouts = SST credit,

No. We have the full company information and should stick to it. We aren't abbreviating Sheffield Lab, Specialty Records, Frankford/Wayne either, even though you'll only find their abbreviations (SLM, SRC, F/W) in the runouts.

azzurro
Or do you propose to keep the current SST (8) profile for Christa?

Alternatively, all SST (8) entries should become
Lacquer Cut At - SST Brüggemann GmbH
Lacquer Cut By - Chris Brüggemann (which maybe should become Christa Brüggemann).

sebfact
We have the full company information

Yes, you do, apparently. You may want to include links to discussions with your updates in the future. That'd be a little bit more helpful than https://www.discogs.sie.com/label/1419912-SST-GmbH/history#latest and would avoid wasting time wondering where those decisions are coming from.
Thanks.

_jules
and would avoid wasting time wondering where those decisions are coming from.

Sure. Even better, I'll ask your for approval for anything I do. I sincerely do not want to waste your valuable time.

leeving
This change to an ANV would include the following engineers:

K SST -> Daniel Krieger
SST AL -> Alex Nimmermann
SST-H -> Michael Haas
SST MW -> Martin Wegner
SST TK -> Theo Krieger

Yes please.

leeving
This change to an ANV would include the following engineers:

K SST -> Daniel Krieger
SST AL -> Alex Nimmermann
SST-H -> Michael Haas
SST MW -> Martin Wegner
SST TK -> Theo Krieger

+1

leeving
This change to an ANV would include the following engineers:
K SST -> Daniel Krieger
SST AL -> Alex Nimmermann
SST-H -> Michael Haas
SST MW -> Martin Wegner
SST TK -> Theo Krieger

Agree.
ANVs, not Aliases, and SST not part of the ANV.

sebfact
Alternatively, all SST (8) entries should become
Lacquer Cut At - SST Brüggemann GmbH
Lacquer Cut By - Chris Brüggemann (which maybe should become Christa Brüggemann).

Personally I would prefer this solution rather than keeping SST (8).

vinyljunkie66
Personally I would prefer this solution rather than keeping SST (8).

yeah...this one should also be changed. I didn't know if I should have included it in this proposal, tho.

i have a little objection:

"SST TK" is a combination of company and engineer and for sure not to consider as alias nor ANV...:

because

"SST" is the identifier to the company/plant
"TK" are the initials of the engineer.

= TK is the ANV of Theo Krieger & "SST" a LCCN credit

(^ same for Daniel Krieger and all the other ones)

OLDFRIENDSFORSALE
i have a little objection:

"SST TK" is a combination of company and engineer and for sure not to consider as alias nor ANV...:

because

"SST" is the identifier to the company/plant
"TK" are the initials of the engineer.

= TK is the ANV of Theo Krieger & "SST" a LCCN credit

(^ same for Daniel Krieger and all the other ones)

That's what we are trying to change...TK would be the ANV, SST would just be used to credit the facility.

The first line of the thread...

leeving
I proposed in the runout groove thread that the alias for Daniel Krieger, K SST, should be changed to K (or Kr) ANV with SST credited as lacquer cutting facility.

(sorry: after a bump i've copy paste with a little alter my 4 months old post in another thread about that issue and overseen the/my first line residue)

leeving
The first line of the thread...

+1

Crossposting from parallel thread:

jweijde
Why not simply credit SST ? Saves everyone the difficult task of determining which company should be credited. The SST profile can be used to clarify the name changes of the company.

Exactly ^^^^
Or Schallplatten Schneid Technik if there's a pressing need to develop abbreviations.
This should be thoroughly considered before embarking on the 8k updates suggested here.

_jules
Exactly ^^^^
Or Schallplatten Schneid Technik if there's a pressing need to develop abbreviations.
This should be thoroughly considered before embarking on the 8k updates suggested here.

I don't see why changing the aliases to ANV's and what this company is named here as related. SST is already credited is some way in most of the subs, so there wouldn't be that much editing those anyway.

Arbitrary timelines have a precedent for other company name changes here, so it's not really a new thing.

GZ, Optimal and others have multiple arbitrary cut off times for the name changes that seems to be working just fine.

leeving
OLDFRIENDSFORSALEi have a little objection:

"SST TK" is a combination of company and engineer and for sure not to consider as alias nor ANV...:

because

"SST" is the identifier to the company/plant
"TK" are the initials of the engineer.

= TK is the ANV of Theo Krieger & "SST" a LCCN credit

(^ same for Daniel Krieger and all the other ones)

That's what we are trying to change...TK would be the ANV, SST would just be used to credit the facility.

The first line of the thread...

leevingI proposed in the runout groove thread that the alias for Daniel Krieger, K SST, should be changed to K (or Kr) ANV with SST credited as lacquer cutting facility.

+1

leeving
GZ, Optimal

Those two are actually credited with their successive full names on releases, at least on some of the media they manufactured, aren't they?

Is that ever the case with SST aka Schallplatten Schneid Technik aka SST GmbH fka SST Brüggemann GmbH?

leeving
I don't see why changing the aliases to ANV's and what this company is named here as related.

The fact the same corpus of 10k entries is potentially affected by the technician and/or lacquer cutting facility name change updates is the relation: one massive round of updates fixing one set of issues (ANVs instead of aliases) and a second tier of [Discussed and Resolved or is it?] issue (splitting a lacquer cutting operation between 2 pages using GmbH names that are never ever credited as such on releases), in just one go.

_jules
Those two are actually credited with their successive full names on releases, at least on some of the media they manufactured, aren't they?

Maybe there are some releases, but for vinyl releases, most of the time they are credited as derived from the runouts.

_jules
The fact the same corpus of 10k entries is potentially affected by the technician and/or lacquer cutting facility name change updates is the relation: one massive round of updates fixing one set of issues (ANVs instead of aliases) and a second tier of [Discussed and Resolved or is it?] issue (splitting a lacquer cutting operation between 2 pages using GmbH names that are never ever credited as such on releases), in just one go.

Well...no one put up much resistance in the thread that decided that issue...and then it was marked "Resolved" and the changes were made. So I'd call it "Discussed and Resolved".

Regardless of GZ and Optimal, using SST or Schallplatten Schneid Technik would still be the best solution because that's closest to what actually appears on the releases and it makes submitting easier.

So you'd rather use the wrong company name for every release rather than an arbitrary cut off date for some of the releases?

Just because something is easy doesn't make it the best way to do it.

And this argument has nothing to do with changing the aliases to anv's.

So, consensus on the ANVs, no?

The company name however should be discussed in Forum Thread #771540 only.

OK, I'm all for converting the Alias into K instead of K SST etc as there is a clear space between K and SST.

I stumbled into this discussion as I was unaware of the fact that we supposedly have stopped using the full ANVs of
https://www.discogs.sie.com/artist/378004-Peter-Dahl?filter_anv=1&anv=PD-CR

In the past, it has been the conduct to use the full name as it is ed together by a "-" as opposed to an @, but I've just learnt that PD-CR has been agreed to be just PD.
This I'm not convinced about, just as I would treat K-SST as a valid ANV.

sebfact
So, consensus on the ANVs, no?

The company name however should be discussed in Forum Thread #771540 only.

IMO we're good to go (mass-edit protocol fulfilled), though based on the number of edits, I'd like to see a back-up from the staff (pinging Diognes_The_Fox ).

On a side-note, I've seen entries where the credit is mastered by, should those be changed to lacquer cuy by (when derived solely from the runouts) while we're at it?

Thank you for the follow-up with this sebfact

In your correspondence with Daniel, have you ever asked him if his etch is a K or really a Kr. The ones I've personally seen all look like there is a little r in the tail, so that's how I make his ANV, but if this really isn't a thing, I can also change these back to just a K. If he has used both, maybe he knows of around what period of time he switched over the the Kr.

IMO we're good to go (mass-edit protocol fulfilled), though based on the number of edits, I'd like to see a back-up from the staff (pinging Diognes_The_Fox)

+1.

Mass edit control lock, set and... [?]

.....don't know why the Quotes didn't work there..

....................................

azzurro
IMO we're good to go (mass-edit protocol fulfilled), though based on the number of edits, I'd like to see a back-up from the staff (pinging Diognes_The_Fox ).

+1

azzurro
On a side-note, I've seen entries where the credit is mastered by, should those be changed to lacquer cuy by (when derived solely from the runouts) while we're at it?

Yes.

leeving
If he has used both, maybe he knows of around what period of time he switched over the the Kr.

I mailed him to ask :-)

sebfact
azzurro
IMO we're good to go (mass-edit protocol fulfilled), though based on the number of edits, I'd like to see a back-up from the staff (pinging Diognes_The_Fox ).
+1

azzurro
On a side-note, I've seen entries where the credit is mastered by, should those be changed to lacquer cuy by (when derived solely from the runouts) while we're at it?
Yes.

leeving
If he has used both, maybe he knows of around what period of time he switched over the the Kr.
I mailed him to ask :-)

:)

azzurro
On a side-note, I've seen entries where the credit is mastered by, should those be changed to lacquer cuy by (when derived solely from the runouts) while we're at it?

Yes; but only where the role in the Common runout groove etchings master list is 'Lacquer Cut At/By'. There are still some that read 'Mastered At/By' for one reason or another, for instance because that facility produces DMM master discs rather than lacquered master discs.

andrenafulva
Yes; but only where the role in the Common runout groove etchings master list is 'Lacquer Cut At/By'. There are still some that read 'Mastered At/By' for one reason or another, for instance because that facility produces DMM master discs rather than lacquered master discs

Don't most of those examples predate the switch to using lacquer cut?

Since the change, we use lacquer cut if only derived from the runout...although not DMM cuts obviously.

leeving
Don't most of those examples predate the switch to using lacquer cut?

They were all changed after the switch. That list is regularly updated.

andrenafulva
Yes; but only where the role in the Common runout groove etchings master list is 'Lacquer Cut At/By'. There are still some that read 'Mastered At/By' for one reason or another, for instance because that facility produces DMM master discs rather than lacquered master discs.

I was talking about the SST credits specifically, I can I added some as Mastered By in the past, hence the question.

azzurro
I was talking about the SST credits specifically, I can I added some as Mastered By in the past, hence the question.

Oh, sorry; sometimes when I'm catching up on updated threads I don't notice which thread I'm on and simply respond to the new comments without that context!

All the SST examples in the runouts list have now been changed to Lacquer Cut At/By.

leeving
a K or really a Kr.

Daniel signed with K SST between 1997 and approx. 2005 (exact month not known), and since then with Kr SST.
Edit replaced time by month

sebfact
Daniel signed with K SST between 1997 and approx. 2005 (exact month not known), and since then with Kr SST.
Edit replaced time by month

Thanks for this info...I didn't think I was reading it wrong.

Just gonna drop +1 from me here as well

All looks good to me. Nice work everyone!

Runout thread adjusted.

SST TK invalidated to start with.

Please also voice your opinion (if not already done) on merging the two SST companies into one here

I just disabled K SST, hope it's ok with everyone?

Profile for SST GmbH should probably also be updated, there are links to K SST/etc in the profile text.

hi, and sorry to disturb, but i’m afraid i have found a new unknown c/o SST (sick...)

please, have a look as soon as possible, at :
-> ’Superpitcher / Wassermann - Speicher 4’
-> ’M. Mayer* / Reinhard Voigt - Speicher 7’

it was the release note ’the etched ‘BII’ includes a roman number’, i have found a little bit strange on the first release,... and then, to refind a similar etched ‘B II’ on the second one, which have made me to react !

actually, my point of view is ‘B’ is the side (for sure !), but the standing alone ‘II’, in roman typography (minimal, as allways from the SST team... !).
think we have to take a good care of this one, updating the others. as, at the moment, it was only found on one, or the other side, than Daniel Krieger’s etch’ !!!

did i have see a mirage, or... ? thank you for your attention, d’

oh, and if you have 2 minutes then... please vote ‘+1’, there :
https://www.discogs.sie.com/forum/thread/776058
it’s about a development suggestion...
please, vote only ! cheers’

You sure it's not B for side B.. like how Side A has an A in the runouts?

dub_e_72
actually, my point of view is ‘B’ is the side (for sure !), but the standing alone ‘II’, in roman typography (minimal, as allways from the SST team... !).

Depends on the location of the roman number II in the matrix in respect to the side indicator B. Sometimes, a second cut is made (as the first one isn't approved by the artist, e.g. due to sound quality), so to distinguish the 2 cutting sessions, an additional number is added to the matrix.

Probably just refers to a second cutting, as https://www.discogs.sie.com/release/121844-Speicher-7/history#latest

Yeah...could be the same as the usual "Re" for recut.

Best not to use it for a lacquer cut credit... i.e. remove the "unknown artist" credit.

leeving
You sure it's not B for side B

definitely not ! please, read the relese note found on ’Speicher 4’.

leeving
remove the "unknown artist" credit.

it’s temporary + anv, only for the team doesn’t merge this one with daniel (unfortunately, anv doesn’t work about ‘unknown artist’... still cannot underastand why ;o( whereas, it could be a great source for the db... imo !). cheers’

azzurro
Probably just refers to a second cutting

sorry azzurro, cannot help you anymore on this point (i’m more wysiwyg...) ! will just try to refind this one in my collec’ and a picture asap... cheers’

hope we will have an answer soon ! thanks for looking leeving !

I would take this issue out of this thread, as I don't believe the II has anything to do with a specific SST cutting engineer. Looks to me that it is a recut side B, perhaps done by Christa Brüggemann.

quite a few examples found via searching...

https://www.discogs.sie.com/search/?format=&track=&barcode=&genre=&anv=&catno=&year=&year=2003&contributor=&decade=2000&style=&matrix=II+SST&title=&country=&artist=&label=&credit=&advanced=1&submitter=&type=release

leeving
I would take this issue out of this thread

no problem leeving ! sorry for the convenient. regards, d’

I hope people won't mind me tacking on a different individual case of the same issue (engineer and studio names in an etching) to this thread rather than starting a new one.

Cohearent Audio, where he has worked since 2010.

I'm seeking permission to remove the studio name from the ANVs so that they are simply 'KG' or 'KPG', and to add Cohearent Audio to LCCN as appropriate.

Should we widen this discussion to a policy on handling all such Engineer-Studio etchings? Or do we need to take each case on its merits?

andrenafulva
I hope people won't mind me tacking on a different individual case of the same issue (engineer and studio names in an etching) to this thread rather than starting a new one.

Kevin Gray has the following ANVs listed: KG@ATM, KPG@ATM, KG@CA, KPG@CA. ATM is AcousTech Mastering, where he worked from 1997 to 2010; CA is Cohearent Audio, where he has worked since 2010.

I'm seeking permission to remove the studio name from the ANVs so that they are simply 'KG' or 'KPG', and to add AcousTech Mastering or Cohearent Audio to LCCN as appropriate.

Should we widen this discussion to a policy on handling all such Engineer-Studio etchings? Or do we need to take each case on its merits?

Guidance on the Common Runouts thread already states to separate them, you can update his page to that information if it isn't already - ANVs with his initials and studio are probably from before the current guidance

andrenafulva
Should we widen this discussion to a policy on handling all such Engineer-Studio etchings? Or do we need to take each case on its merits?

These are the same topic, but I think it should be brought up in its own thread as this would be a correct edit, but with 100+ edits, it's good policy to get the backing of others.

andrenafulva
I'm seeking permission to remove the studio name from the ANVs so that they are simply 'KG' or 'KPG', and to add AcousTech Mastering or Cohearent Audio to LCCN as appropriate.

+1

leeving
These are the same topic, but I think it should be brought up in its own thread as this would be a correct edit, but with 100+ edits, it's good policy to get the backing of others.

+1

leeving
I think it should be brought up in its own thread

Done. Thanks, all of you.

I have another suggestion / question

Shall we merge profiles of HL (2)?

I’d go with the full name but was wondering what yall think

zin
I have another suggestion / question

Shall we merge profiles of Heino Leja and HL (2)?

I’d go with the full name but was wondering what yall think

Feel free to make a new thread about that.

Chris Brüggemann.
Unless, of course we don't want to credit her at all anymore because, strictly speaking, SST is just the location.

sebfact
SST (8) should now become Lacquer Cut By Chris Brüggemann.
Unless, of course we don't want to credit her at all anymore because, strictly speaking, SST is just the location.

Are you saying we should be reverting the alias for her, too? When I made this thread I was thinking more of the ones with initials and location etchings, hers with just SST seems fine for an alias to me.

Lacquer Cut By SST (8)
Lacquer Cut At SST Brüggemann GmbH

seem just fine for me for her credits.

Difficult one if you ask me.

On one hand, it sounds counter-intuitive to link a SST etching to Chris Brüggemann, although that's what we do (or the other way around) on more etchings.

On the other hand, it's fine as it is now, mass moving >6000 entries will take some time.

sebfact
SST (8) should now become Lacquer Cut By Chris Brüggemann.

+1 ! should be nice for the database...

Just linking to Paul van der Jonckheyd.

andrenafulva
Just linking to this thread on which there is a potentially similar case with Foon and Paul van der Jonckheyd

How did you came to conclusion that Foon can be ANV of Paul van der Jonckheyd?

Todeskult
How did you came to conclusion that Foon can be ANV of Paul van der Jonckheyd?

Read the thread and you'll see that entirely the opposite is the case. (For goodness' sake!)

ugh...that Foon thread is a hot mess. I totally forgot about that argument.

I get that if Foon was Paul's last name, it could be argued that Foon was both the person and company, but we went through an issue with GOLDEN stamp that we had to remove the ANV associated with John Golden - so GOLDEN is now just the facility, even though there are a lot of releases without any initials - and most were done before his kids started cutting.

About dub_e_72

Let's stay in this thread...

Kr is an abbreviation - abbreviations to a name are almost always an ANV (probably always, but i'm sure there's an outlier somewhere like HL (2). (which I think should be an ANV - now that we know who it is.)

It's not a "name" to differentiate the work.

If he etched something that couldn't be considered initials to his actual name, then it would be an alias.

This would be a rabbit hole if runout initials are all supposed to be aliases if that person was credited on some release in a different role.

- What exactly is a different role? - Mastering vs Lacquer cut - Would CB be an alias if Chris Bellman is credited for Mastering on the release?

He's credited for Remix on a release (as Chris Bellman) - so everyone of his runout CB initials should now be changed to an alias??

This doesn't seem to be what that guideline is talking about.

leeving
What exactly is a different role?

Playing instruments in a band, like Daniel Krieg do/did + cutting vinyls at SST. RSG §2.5.3 doesn't work in that case?

leeving
He's credited for Remix on a release (as Chris Bellman) - so everyone of his runout CB initials should now be changed to an alias??

Nope, he is/was doing vocals and playing some instruments in bands Mau Tempo

leeving
This doesn't seem to be what that guideline is talking about.

Nope, that is exactly what the guideline is taking about. That is how I understand the phrase "ANVs should not be used if the artist uses the name to differentiate their work, in this case an Alias is more appropriate". If playing music and doing lacquer cuts are works not different enough then what is?

Todeskult
Nope, he is/was doing vocals and playing some instruments in bands Killrays and Mau Tempo

I get that...but how far do we take "differentiate their work" if by "work" it means role/credit.

My example above is that Chris Bellman was credited for remixing as Chris Bellman - should that then make all his ANV CB's in the runouts actually be aliases?

Again, I don't think this HL (2) is a different case, because it was unknown when first created, but should really be looked at further - as being initials, should be an ANV.

leeving
I get that...but how far do we take "differentiate their work" if by "work" it means role/credit.

That is also a problem, I guess more clarification about how to interpret the phrase "differentiate their work" we should get from nik, because it appears to be a field of everybody's own interpretation.

leeving
My example above is that Chris Bellman was credited for remixing as Chris Bellman - should that then make all his ANV CB's in the runouts actually be aliases?

If we stick literally to the RSG §2.5.3 then I guess it should be.
But in that case we should rework a thousands of artists, for example Dave Grohl was (just) playing drums in Nirvana, but afterwards he became a frontman of Foo Fighters, doing vocals and playing guitars. Does it qualify for "differentiation of works" or not? Should we create a new profile for him - Dave Grohl (2) and link it to Foo Fighters releases, leaving the first one for Nirvana only? I guess that would be the stupidest thing to do...

leeving
Again, I don't think this RSG §2.5.3 is to be used for initials of the PAN

That's correct in my opinion too, but why it isn't so in a Heino Leja case then?

leeving
HL (2) is a different case, because it was unknown when first created, but should really be looked at further - as being initials, should be an ANV.

It is not different (or rather should not be). Once we know the true name of the artist that name should be treated as PAN (as I do understand a full known name of the person as being the "most relevant version of the Artists Name" (RSG §2.5.6), so then any abbreviations of it such as HL, H L, LH or whatever similar we can encounter become ANV. In this case there is also no "differentiation" factor as both aliases/names/whatever are being used to credit the same work: vinyl cutting/mastering

Todeskult
It is not different (or rather should not be). Once we know the true name of the artist that name should be treated as PAN (as I do understand a full known name of the person as being the "most relevant version of the Artists Name" (RSG §2.5.6), so then any abbreviations of it such as HL, H L, LH or whatever similar we can encounter become ANV. In this case there is also no "differentiation" factor as both aliases/names/whatever are being used to credit the same work: vinyl cutting/mastering

It was only different in the creation of the PAN HL (2) - I agree that once it was discovered who this individual was all credits should have been changed to an ANV.

Or make Heino Leja an ANV of HL (2) - as a name variation should work both ways.

I haven't read that whole thread, so I don't really know what the basis is for not wanting to use an ANV for the HL, so I can't really comment too much on that.

No need for an alias, as explained from my side here:
https://www.discogs.sie.com/forum/thread/801975?utm_campaign=thread-notify&utm_medium=pm&page=1&utm_source=relationship#7964388

punkergott
No need for an alias, as explained from my side here:
https://www.discogs.sie.com/forum/thread/801975?utm_campaign=thread-notify&utm_medium=pm&page=1&utm_source=relationship#7964388

OK, so how is it different when comes to Heino Leja vs HL?
https://www.discogs.sie.com/forum/thread/801798

Todeskult
OK, so how is it different when comes to Heino Leja vs HL?
https://www.discogs.sie.com/forum/thread/801798

Imho they should be merged

Same here Bob Weston (4), should also be merged.

sorry i'm late:

leeving
Kr is an abbreviation of Krieger

+1

Todeskult
"K+", "Kr" signs

Daniel Krieger's signature is for sure not a "K+"
one is Kr (ed caps K and small R) and the other one KR (caps K and subscript stylized caps R)

why not do same as with Brian Gardner?

Lacquer Cut By [Kr SST Etching] – Daniel Krieger

______
quotes from the other thread, i confused the topics
https://www.discogs.sie.com/forum/thread/801975?page=1#7964361

I see Martin Wegner have ANV's with "SST" the others not . . .

but "SST" is not part of the Name, it's the identifier to the company

no.signal
I see Daniel Krieger / Martin Wegner have ANV's with "SST" the others not . . .

not sure what you ask, but just in case, we have a list on discogs with guidance about how to enter run-out etchings. please try a control-f ‘sst’, in example... hope this will help you, d’

no.signal
I see Daniel Krieger / Martin Wegner have ANV's with "SST" the others not .

Thanks for raising that. When I click on those ANVs, the number of releases isn't filtered. This suggests either that those are 'ghost ANVs' (ANVs added to roles that don't link to the artist page) or that's a bug and those ANVs have all been cleared. I'll post them in the ghost ANVs thread in case anyone can find them there.

Edit: no, there's something going wrong with ANV filtering on artist pages at the moment. There are indeed a lot of ANVs remaining including SST: many on this list, for instance, do so: https://www.discogs.sie.com/search/?q=%22Kr+SST%22+716158&type=release

I think that, given the number of releases involved, the task simply hasn't been completed yet. If you want to help update those ANVs to match the current advice in the list of common runout groove etchings, that would be appreciated.

andrenafulva
there's something going wrong with ANV filtering on artist pages at the moment.

staff is working on -> https://www.discogs.sie.com/forum/thread/743020?page=5#8145394
this has appeared last friday. hope this will be resolved soon.

dub_e_72
staff is working on

Oh, thanks. I won't worry about it any more, then.

dub_e_72
control-f ‘sst’, in example... hope this will help you

it does. thankyou

and as far as i can see in the SST sub-section there's no "K+" reference
seems it falls under the aforementioned ANV bug
now i see that if i klick on the K+ or Kr ANV the results are both 3,660...

andrenafulva
I won't worry about it any more, then.

O.K.

I've noticed occasional K+'s and Kr SST's popping up every now and again since we moved to strictly Kr or K as the ANV.

I fix them when I see them, but fixing these now with have to wait with the ANV filtering not working at the moment.

It's usually just 1 or 2 at a time, so using the ANV of just Kr seems to have worked pretty well in the year that we changed it.

50 are "K+" . . .
https://www.discogs.sie.com/artist/716158-Daniel-Krieger?anv=K%2B&filter_anv=1

I see the ANV filtering is working.

There are also 52 K SST anv's - https://www.discogs.sie.com/artist/716158-Daniel-Krieger?anv=K+SST&filter_anv=1
20 Kr SST - https://www.discogs.sie.com/artist/716158-Daniel-Krieger?anv=Kr+SST&filter_anv=1
4 SST K - https://www.discogs.sie.com/artist/716158-Daniel-Krieger?anv=SST+K&filter_anv=1

no.signal
K+

still not solved...

no.signal
K+
still not solved...

It's been solved (Daniel Krieger + ANV Kr); someone just needs to make the edits.

andrenafulva
someone just needs to make the edits

ping mr. fearless mass edit hero Same.Old.Me: we have a job for you :-)

[current number: 66] target: K+ ANV should be Kr ANV
https://www.discogs.sie.com/artist/716158-Daniel-Krieger?anv=K%2B&filter_anv=1

no.signal
we have a job for you :-)

done :-)

no.signal
we have a job for you :-)

I leave you the honour! 😉

azzurro
done :-)

wow! Hero! ♥

azzurro
done :-)

somehow 18 are back again?

no.signal
K+ ANV should be Kr ANV
https://www.discogs.sie.com/artist/716158-Daniel-Krieger?anv=K%2B&filter_anv=1

Hi https://www.discogs.sie.com/release/5971843-Right-Idea/history?diff=9&page=1

K+ ANV should be Kr ANV