DiskXpress - mould SID code and LCCN numbers

Thread to discuss my intention for identifying and crediting English disc manufacturing plant DiskXpress based on mould SID code and sequential matrix number

Diskxpress - manufacturer which ran a plant in Gloucestershire (I'm unsure when the plant started and ended operations)

### Credited on mid-1990s CDs by DISKXPRESS in the disc matrix.
Examples:
Various - Platipus Records Volume Two
These CDs have no SID codes, so it's hard to pin down where they may have been glass mastered, but possibly replicated by DiskXpress

### Around 1998, a 5-digit matrix number NNNNN and mould SID code IFPI 8Y** began appearing.

-> A small number of such discs exist that name DISKXPRESS in full in the matrix: Saddar Bazaar - Path Of The Rose

-> A larger number instead use the initialism 'DXP' in the matrix: https://www.discogs.sie.com/search/?q=%22ifpi8y%22+%22dxp%22&type=release

-> And probably an even larger number don't directly refer to DiskXpress at all in the matrix

### It seems likely that DiskXpress never did in-house glass mastering - glass masters that I've come across with 8Y** include Independent Masters Ltd. The matrix will usually include the initial of the glass master origin (N, E, FT, I respectively).

### From the few releases with matrix numbers linked in LCCN so far, the NNNNN number appears to be sequential and chronological. Here's a 2CD release with almost directly sequential numbering: Various - Trancentral Eight

The NNNNN number is also present in combination with IFPI 8Y** +/- DXP across all 4 different glass master origins. Saddar Bazaar - Path Of The Rose is a good example.

Matrix / Runout (Variant 1): DISKXPRESS 00470 DELECCD068 SPFT 11095/1031898
Mastering SID Code (Variant 1): none
Mould SID Code (Variant 1): ifpi 8Y03
Matrix / Runout (Variant 2 - Mirrored): AAC2312 00470 DELECCD068SP •
Matrix / Runout (Variant 2 - Additional Moulded): 1 : 0
Mastering SID Code (Variant 2 - Mirrored): IFPI L123
Mould SID Code (Variant 2): ifpi 8Y07

CONCLUSION

(1) Given that we know that DiskXpress ran its own manufacturing plant, and that its name or initialism co-occurs with IFPI 8Y** on several dozen releases so far, I think it should be fair to make the association between the two.
(2) Given that NNNNN is a release-specific number that accompanies IFPI 8Y** across different glass master variants, I believe it is worthy to be entered in LCCN
(3) When DISKXPRESS or DXP is not found in the matrix, the combination of NNNNN and IFPI 8Y** should be sufficient to assign a Pressed By entry for DiskXpress

Input welcome!

Pinging (if interested): Mr.Slut

Myriad
CONCLUSION

(1) Given that we know that DiskXpress ran its own manufacturing plant, and that its name or initialism co-occurs with IFPI 8Y** on several dozen releases so far, I think it should be fair to make the association between the two.
(2) Given that NNNNN is a release-specific number that accompanies IFPI 8Y** across different glass master variants, I believe it is worthy to be entered in LCCN
(3) When DISKXPRESS or DXP is not found in the matrix, the combination of NNNNN and IFPI 8Y** should be sufficient to assign a Pressed By entry for DiskXpress

I don’t know much about this plant but your research seems solid and I’m good with this.

Myriad
CONCLUSION

(1) Given that we know that DiskXpress ran its own manufacturing plant, and that its name or initialism co-occurs with IFPI 8Y** on several dozen releases so far, I think it should be fair to make the association between the two.
(2) Given that NNNNN is a release-specific number that accompanies IFPI 8Y** across different glass master variants, I believe it is worthy to be entered in LCCN
(3) When DISKXPRESS or DXP is not found in the matrix, the combination of NNNNN and IFPI 8Y** should be sufficient to assign a Pressed By entry for DiskXpress

I also don't know much about Diskxpress, but good research
+1

Opdiner
I don’t know much about this plant but your research seems solid and I’m good with this.

Same here. (I actually know nothing about this plant).

Can't help either when it comes to CD data, but this makes sense on paper -- +1.

Myriad
CONCLUSION

+1

Myriad
Saddar Bazaar - Path Of The Rose is a good example

That example used invalid Disk Xpress together with another 13 releases.

I don’t know anything about this plant but your research seems solid so I’m fine with this.

Myriad
(1) Given that we know that DiskXpress ran its own manufacturing plant, and that its name or initialism co-occurs with IFPI 8Y** on several dozen releases so far, I think it should be fair to make the association between the two.
(2) Given that NNNNN is a release-specific number that accompanies IFPI 8Y** across different glass master variants, I believe it is worthy to be entered in LCCN
(3) When DISKXPRESS or DXP is not found in the matrix, the combination of NNNNN and IFPI 8Y** should be sufficient to assign a Pressed By entry for DiskXpress

Agreed.

handmedownurluv
Agreed.

+ 1 from me as well.

Well researched and a +1 from me as well.
The plant was located at Willow Court, Bourton Industrial Park, Bourton-on-the-Water, Gloucestershire GL54 2HQ; Tel: 01451820070; Fax: 01451820075.
The London office until 1991 was at 5 Cross Lane, London N8 7SA, Tel: 0181-348 4414 Fax: 0181-348 2252.

Seems to have started operations in 1984 already. Was ordered to be wound up in 1991 and went into receivership until 1997. Finally dissolved in September 2018.

Myriad
CONCLUSION
...

+1 and from me. Great identification.

I checked a few issues from myself and everything fits. Additional example:

Forward Technology (Sublabels: Forward Sound & Vision, ODC UK) - 14191
Pressed By - Diskxpress - 02217
Matrix / Runout (Variant 1): DISKXPRESS 02217 CANDLE035CD FT 14191/1 012199
Mould SID Code (Variant 1): ifpi 8Y01
Matrix / Runout (Variant 2): DISKXPRESS 02217 CANDLE035CD FT 14191/1 012199
Mould SID Code (Variant 2): IFPI 8Y08
Matrix / Runout (Variant 3): DISKXPRESS 02217 CANDLE035CD FT 14191/1 012199
Mould SID Code (Variant 3): ifpi 8Y05
Matrix / Runout (Variant 4): DISKXPRESS 02217 CANDLE035CD FT 14191/1 012199
Mould SID Code (Variant 4): ifpi 8Y07

and

Burning Inside - The Eve Of The Entities
Glass Mastered At - FSV - 23142
Pressed By - Diskxpress - 05788
There is no literal abbreviation but there is a matrix number matching FSV: "...and credited by a combination of NNNNN (five-digit matrix number) and MMDDYY (date code in matrix) plus/minus IFPI LD81 plus/minus..."
Matrix / Runout (Variant 1): 05788 BS32362CD 23142 110400
Mastering SID Code (Variant1): IFPI LD81
Mould SID Code (Variant 1): IFPI 8Y13
Matrix / Runout (Variant 2): 05788 BS32362CD 23142 110400
Mastering SID Code (Variant 2): ifpi LD81
Mould SID Code (Variant 2): ifpi 8Y04

CharonNecrosis
FT -> Forward Technology (Sublabels: Forward Sound & Vision, ODC UK) - 14191

I have been asg such releases to FSV rather than Forward Technology. Forward Technology was the parent company but Forward Sound & Vision and FSV are the names under which that glass master manufacturer actually operated

Myriad
Forward Technology was the parent company but Forward Sound & Vision and FSV are the names under which that glass master manufacturer actually operated

I agree. This is what it looks like. In such cases I can suggest in the main profile FSV.

E.g.:
Emperor (2) - IX Equilibrium
Made By - Forward Technology
Manufactured By - FSV - 14191
Pressed By - Diskxpress - 02217
Matrix / Runout (Variant 1): DISKXPRESS 02217 CANDLE035CD FT 14191/1 012199
Mould SID Code (Variant 1): ifpi 8Y01
...

Manufactured By - Due to the lack of mastering SID code.
I am convinced that the FSV did the matrix, but from experience I know that the role of "Glass Mastered At" will be difficult to get without the SID code.

Thanks all for replies so far. Will go ahead with this over the weekend unless any opposition comes up

The IFPI 8Y** mould SIDs disappear after 2004:

https://www.discogs.sie.com/search/?sort=year%2Cdesc&q=ifpi8y&type=release&format_exact=CD&layout=med

However, the last matrix number seems to be for a 2002 release: 137

What do we do with IFPI 8Y** CDs made in the remaining couple of years? Do we credits Diskxpress? Do we split from CDs with different mould SIDs?

handmedownurluv
What do we do with IFPI 8Y** CDs made in the remaining couple of years? Do we credits Diskxpress? Do we split from CDs with different mould SIDs?

I would say we shouldn't credit Diskxpress, and we shouldn't split. Probably Diskxpress went out of business around 2002 and its machines were sold to a new plant. I've seen IFPI 8Y** variants on CDs manufactured by Lynic and by MPO Broadcrest, so I'd say most likely one of both of those plants acquired CD lines from Diskxpress.

We should only credit Diskxpress by the combination of its NNNNN matrix number AND the mould SID code. Not by the mould SID alone, and especially not when Lynic or MPO Broadcrest is indicated by other matrix information.

CharonNecrosis
Myriad Various - Trancentral Eight
Look at the LCCN, is that correct?

The two Manufactured By roles need to be changed to Glass Mastered At, and instead of FSV, its predecessor name Forward Sound & Vision should be credited

Myriad

......road testing the updated Diskxpress profile.

Have I got this one right? Arena (11) - Breakfast In Biarritz

spekem
Have I got this one right? Arena (11) - Breakfast In Biarritz

looks good :)

Myriad
We should only credit Diskxpress by the combination of its NNNNN matrix number AND the mould SID code. Not by the mould SID alone, and especially not when Lynic or MPO Broadcrest is indicated by other matrix information.

+1 I agree with that assumption.

P.S. Various - Trancentral Eight - corrected.
Thanks

Sorry I don't own CD's and have knowledge in these things.

Myriad
Probably Diskxpress went out of business around 2002 and its machines were sold to a new plant.

It would be worthwhile for the profile to include this indicative cautionary information, or similar, rather than having it open ended?

spekem
It would be worthwhile for the profile to include this indicative cautionary information, or similar, rather than having it open ended?

Good suggestion, have just done that thanks!

Also added a line to describe SP = Sound Performance and that the SP is often squashed together with the glass master ID - SPE, SPN, etc.

Brilliant Myriad!

Hello,

I have a few questions about some releases which are now credited to Diskxpress:

Two releases are assigned to Diskxpress, but the Matrix looks different and does not actually contain ‘DXP’.
Nathan McCree - Tomb Raider
Matrix: 2:2 00163 TOMBRENG dXPE
J.J. Burnel - Euroman Cometh
Matrix: AAC1481 00561 EW0002CDDXP

The Matrix number 037078 doesn’t match the pattern, has one digit more
Various - The Biggest Ragga Dancehall Anthems 99
Matrix / Runout (Disc 1): AAC2674 037078GREZCD4001-1 : 1:0 [NIMBUS]
Mastering SID Code (Disc 1): IFPI L123
Mould SID Code (Disc 1): ifpi 8Y01
Matrix / Runout (Disc 2): AAC2675 03708GREZCD4001-2 • 1:4
Mastering SID Code (Disc 2): IFPI L123
Mould SID Code (Disc 2): ifpi 8Y01

Six releases are out of sequence.
Unknown Artist - Pan Pipes Play The Music Of The Beatles
LCCN number: 00080
Release Year: 1999
surrounding numbers were released in 1996

Largeman - Plaything / Newboy
LCCN number: 00347
Release Year: 1999
surrounding numbers were released in 1998

Shadowland (2) - Ring Of Roses
LCCN number: 00929
Release Year 1997
surrounding numbers were released in 1998

Unknown Artist - 21 Songs, Stories & Nursery Rhymes
LCCN number: 00939
Release Year: 1999
surrounding numbers were released in 1998

Mr. Vegas - Heads High
LCCN number: 02898
Release Year: 1998
surrounding numbers were released in 1999

The Poozies - Come Raise Your Head
LCCN number: 03488
Release Year: 1997
surrounding numbers were released in 1999

Two Matrix numbers are being used twice.
Various - De Concerten Van De Eeuw
Matrix: TF91102 CD Systems UK 03073
Resulting number: 03073
Feeder - Swim
Matrix: 03073 ECHCD09 SP I || 1043012
Resulting number: 03073

X-Cabs - Neuro 99
Matrix: 03588 HKCDS44 SP F 17003 100299
Resulting number: 03588
Sasha - Global Underground 013: Ibiza
Matrix: 03588 GU013CD-1 SP F 16656 090899
Resulting number: 03588

Following the example given on the Diskxpress profile, Saddar Bazaar - Path Of The Rose
there are actually only 11 releases out of 59 with Diskxpress in matrix that also have a number in matrix.
7 starting with 0
Unknown Artist - Country Guitar Salutes John Denver
00432
Various - Trancentral Eight
00523
00525
Various - Club Class Volume 10
00738
Emperor (2) - IX Equilibrium
02217
4 starting with 5
Antara (11) - Peru Inca Land - Music From The Andes
50144
Frederick Rousseau* - Abyss
50158
Dummy Run - Dummy Run
50399
The Enid - One Of Another
50621

Is that really enough to make out a pattern?

I made diagrams of these numbers, you'll find them on my profile page. They do not look sequential. Given the fast turnover times in CD business I think it is pretty unlikely that a number range primarly used in one year will be used two years later.

dborap
Two releases are assigned to Diskxpress, but the Matrix looks different and does not actually contain ‘DXP’.
Nathan McCree - Tomb Raider
Matrix: 2:2 00163 TOMBRENG dXPE
J.J. Burnel - Euroman Cometh
Matrix: AAC1481 00561 EW0002CDDXP

Both of those matrix strings contain DXP.
Matrix: 2:2 00163 TOMBRENG dXPE
Matrix: AAC1481 00561 EW0002CDDXP

dborap
The Matrix number 037078 doesn’t match the pattern, has one digit more

If you look at it, there is almost certainly a mis-transcription of the matrix numbers here, with 037077 being likely on CD1 and 03708 on CD2.

dborap
Six releases are out of sequence.

They are not out of sequence. The Diskxpress matrix number sequence would reflect the sequence in which orders were made by labels for manufacturing by Diskxpress. That doesn't always translate into the same sequence of release dates as some releases are delayed, mispressed, etc. I won't address all 6 examples, but the following explanation can apply to all of them:

dborap
Shadowland (2) - Ring Of Roses
LCCN number: 00929
Release Year 1997
surrounding numbers were released in 1998

This could in fact be a second pressing of the album released in 1998, and the first pressing has different matrix info. Or it could be that the release date 1997 is incorrect. Or it could be that it was released in December 1997 and the "surrounding releases" were released in January 1998. And so on.

dborap
there are actually only 11 releases out of 59 with Diskxpress in matrix that also have a number in matrix.
7 starting with 0

dborap
Is that really enough to make out a pattern?

What are you trying to say here? Do you doubt that the combination of 5-digit matrix number + IFPI 8Y** +/- DXP/DISKXPRESS is sufficient to identify these discs as Disxpress pressings? Or something else?

Myriad
This could in fact be a second pressing of the album released in 1998, and the first pressing has different matrix info. Or it could be that the release date 1997 is incorrect. Or it could be that it was released in December 1997 and the "surrounding releases" were released in January 1998. And so on.

That's a lot of could be.

Myriad
What are you trying to say here? Do you doubt that the combination of 5-digit matrix number + IFPI 8Y** +/- DXP/DISKXPRESS is sufficient to identify these discs as Disxpress pressings?

Yes. I doubt that releases without DXP or DISKXPRESS in matrix actually are Diskxpress.

sebfact
Well researched and a +1 from me as well.
The plant was located at Willow Court, Bourton Industrial Park, Bourton-on-the-Water, Gloucestershire GL54 2HQ; Tel: 01451820070; Fax: 01451820075.
The London office until 1991 was at 5 Cross Lane, London N8 7SA, Tel: 0181-348 4414 Fax: 0181-348 2252.

Seems to have started operations in 1984 already. Was ordered to be wound up in 1991 and went into receivership until 1997. Finally dissolved in September 2018.

Where do these addresses come from?
The only one I could find is 641 Green Lanes, London., N8 0RE. https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/01786191/filing-history
It looks as if the company had liquidity problems from 1995 onwards and operations might have exceeded in 1997.
There are a few releases from 1998 and 1999 credited with Diskxpress in the matrix, so the actual closing date might have been in 1999.

dborap
Where do these addresses come from?

From a listing in Music Week, 20 May 2000.
IINM, the address you have could either be the office address of the ordered ant or they moved their office there after 5 Cross Lane had to be given up in 1991.
It seems that the company had problems since 1991, when a first winding up order was issued.

dborap
Yes. I doubt that releases without DXP or DISKXPRESS in matrix actually are Diskxpress.

Why?

Myriad
Why?

The numbers are not sequential. Time is money in CD business.
CD manufacturers having problems with delays is true since about 2018
https://www.billboard.com/music/music-news/cds-out-of-stock-manufacturing-moved-mexico-eminem-lil-wayne-8483294/
“A year ago, you could order CDs to be manufactured and get them delivered in two or three weeks, and if you had a hot title, you could get a quick [turnaround] within one week,” says a sales executive. “Today, CD manufacturing now requires four to eight weeks of lead time, while the quick turnaround on a hot title now takes at least 10 days.”

dborap
Two Matrix numbers are being used twice.
Various - De Concerten Van De Eeuw
Matrix: TF91102 CD Systems UK 03073
Resulting number: 03073
Feeder - Swim
Matrix: 03073 ECHCD09 SP I || 1043012
Resulting number: 03073

X-Cabs - Neuro 99
Matrix: 03588 HKCDS44 SP F 17003 100299
Resulting number: 03588
Sasha - Global Underground 013: Ibiza
Matrix: 03588 GU013CD-1 SP F 16656 090899
Resulting number: 03588

What about these?
In my opinion this shows that something is not quite right with the pattern.

There are ~1000 releases linked on the Diskxpress profile currently with a pretty obvious sequential nature to the matrix numbers. 5#### was used briefly at first, then 0#### after that, starting with 000## in 1996 and ascending up to 07### in 2001. If you can't see the sequential nature in this then I don't think you understand what sequential means.

dborap
What about these?
In my opinion this shows that something is not quite right with the pattern.

These are interesting examples. It could be errors by the plant in asg numbers, or something else. In any case, these four releases make up 0.4% of releases on the Diskxpress profile so far. Does an 0.4% error rate invalidate a sequential numbering scheme?

Myriad
If you can't see the sequential nature in this then I don't think you understand what sequential means.

Wow.
So sequential means in your example:
50075 1996
50158 1996
50220 1996
50221 1996
50222 1996
50399 1996
50456 1999
50482 1996
50621 1995
50833 1997
50834 1997
50994 1997
51062 1997
51062 1997
51063 1997
51063 1997
51129 1997
51129 1997
51141 1997
51142 1997
51173 1996
51247 1997
51248 1997
51250 1997
51333 1997
51334 1997
51335 1997
51347 1997
51348 1997
51396 1997
51397 1997
51398 1997
51405 1997
51417 1997
51457 1997
51458 1997
51461 1997
51468 1997
51478 1997
51479 1997
51481 1997
51485 1997
51486 1997
51517 1998
51535 1998
51536 1997
51547 1997
51547 1998
51549 1997
51563 1996
51566 1997

dborap
Hello,

I have a few questions about some releases which are now credited to Diskxpress:

Two releases are assigned to Diskxpress, but the Matrix looks different and does not actually contain ‘DXP’.
Nathan McCree - Tomb Raider
Matrix: 2:2 00163 TOMBRENG dXPE
J.J. Burnel - Euroman Cometh
Matrix: AAC1481 00561 EW0002CDDXP

Emphasis mine.

dborap
The Matrix number 037078 doesn’t match the pattern, has one digit more
Various - The Biggest Ragga Dancehall Anthems 99
Matrix / Runout (Disc 1): AAC2674 037078GREZCD4001-1 : 1:0 [NIMBUS]
Mastering SID Code (Disc 1): IFPI L123
Mould SID Code (Disc 1): ifpi 8Y01
Matrix / Runout (Disc 2): AAC2675 03708GREZCD4001-2 • 1:4
Mastering SID Code (Disc 2): IFPI L123
Mould SID Code (Disc 2): ifpi 8Y01

Could be a typo, do you have the CD to check the matrix? Ask someone to otherwise, preferably the submitter of the matrix data.

dborap
Six releases are out of sequence.
Unknown Artist - Pan Pipes Play The Music Of The Beatles
LCCN number: 00080
Release Year: 1999
surrounding numbers were released in 1996

Same label released it also in 1996, reissues frequently re-use glass masters or internal numbers.

dborap
Largeman - Plaything / Newboy
LCCN number: 00347
Release Year: 1999
surrounding numbers were released in 1998

When did it come out? Images shows no year and submitter shows no source for the date. This is an unsourced date to me.

dborap
Shadowland (2) - Ring Of Roses
LCCN number: 00929
Release Year 1997
surrounding numbers were released in 1998

It has a copyright of 1997. The release date guidelines are clear about this. In absence of other information it is the date do use. You don't go and put 1988 on a release with SID Codes? or a release made by EDC do you if the copyright says 1988? Correct?

dborap
Unknown Artist - 21 Songs, Stories & Nursery Rhymes
LCCN number: 00939
Release Year: 1999
surrounding numbers were released in 1998

No years visible on scan. The catalog number allocated for this release is lower than catalog numbers assigned 1998 on the label.

dborap
Mr. Vegas - Heads High
LCCN number: 02898
Release Year: 1998
surrounding numbers were released in 1999

Copyright is 1998. Last release on CD by the label before copyrights start saying 1999. When exactly did this come out?

Warepire
Two releases are assigned to Diskxpress, but the Matrix looks different and does not actually contain ‘DXP’.
Nathan McCree - Tomb Raider
Matrix: 2:2 00163 TOMBRENG dXPE
J.J. Burnel - Euroman Cometh
Matrix: AAC1481 00561 EW0002CDDXP

English is not my first language. What I meant was these two releases do not exactly credit DXP, but dXPE and CDDXP instead which could be something different.

Nathan McCree - Tomb Raider has no mould SID code, but the pattern to identify Diskxpress is a supposedly sequential number + mould SID?

dborap
So sequential means in your example:

Yes. >90% of the items in that list are sequential. Others are explained by errors, typos, later pressings, and delayed releases, all of which has already been explained to you.

Warepire has given you some good examples of the fact that you cannot ever trust a release date on a Discogs submission unless you have a verifiable primary source in the submission history.

dborap
Nathan McCree - Tomb Raider has no mould SID code, but the pattern to identify Diskxpress is a supposedly sequential number + mould SID?

'DXPE' in the matrix of that submission is a combination of 'DXP' (the pressing plant) and 'E' which refers to EMI Swindon who manufactured the glass master. The Diskxpress profile has a section explaining the use of letters to identify the glass master origin

dborap a small number of outliers in datasets don't invalidate conclusions drawn from the great majority of the data. They are statistically exceptions that prove the rule.

These outliers are more in the nature of data 'UFO's' and having identified them the next step is not to conclude that the conclusions are wrong/invalid, as you appear to be doing, but to try and find a reasonable explanation for what may have caused these outliers to be there.

And, as you have seen from the responses there are plenty of reasonable explanations.