Tips for a great italo disco tune -

I have to confess something: all my life I wondered why songs like these:
BALTIMORA - TARZAN BOY
BALTIMORA - WOODY BOOGIE
SCOTCH - DISCO BAND
SCOTCH - DELIRIO MIND
LOU SERN - SWISS BOY
VIDEO KIDS - WOODPECKERS FROM SPACE
KEN LASZLO - HEY HEY GUY
R. BAIS - DIAL MY NUMBER
GLEN WHITE - TV LOVER
JIMMY & SUSY - COME BACK
cannot be repeated and repeatable! I always thought those attractive sounds made the songs so famous and appealing (like, Tarzan's yelling, woodpecker's beak knock, the Swiss yodeling, the cough or the man's scream, in Scotch, or the telephone dialing in Hey Hey Guy and in several other songs, the laugh of Kano, the train horns from Jimmy & Susy, or the Russian melodies in USSR - Eddy Huntington or Russia - Fable Time).

I asked a good friend, composer, why italo disco writers don't use those sounds anymore, to make the new italo songs unforgettable! He told me those sounds were cool back in the day, because at that time the sampler was revolutionary, but they aren't cool nowadays! On the contrary, I think those sounds make an italo disco song memorable, that's why I want to bring to your attention that dispute, because I need your opinion!

So, what do you guys think: would these kind of sounds be appealing nowadays, when they are not used anymore, or would they lose their former shine, just because they are not cool anymore today, when sampler is quaint and obsolete?! Would you like those effects again or rather consider them expired, outdated?

Waiting for anyone's input! The more they come, the more statistically significant they will be!

danisberg
I have to confess something: all my life I wondered why songs like these:
BALTIMORA - TARZAN BOY
BALTIMORA - WOODY BOOGIE
SCOTCH - DISCO BAND
SCOTCH - DELIRIO MIND
LOU SERN - SWISS BOY
VIDEO KIDS - WOODPECKERS FROM SPACE
KEN LASZLO - HEY HEY GUY
R. BAIS - DIAL MY NUMBER
GLEN WHITE - TV LOVER
JIMMY & SUSY - COME BACK
cannot be repeated and repeatable! I always thought those attractive sounds made the songs so famous and appealing (like, Tarzan's yelling, woodpecker's beak knock, the Swiss yodeling, the cough or the man's scream, in Scotch, or the telephone dialing in Hey Hey Guy and in several other songs, the laugh of Kano, the train horns from Jimmy & Susy, or the Russian melodies in USSR - Eddy Huntington or Russia - Fable Time).

I asked a good friend, composer, why italo disco writers don't use those sounds anymore, to make the new italo songs unforgettable! He told me those sounds were cool back in the day, because at that time the sampler was revolutionary, but they aren't cool nowadays! On the contrary, I think those sounds make an italo disco song memorable, that's why I want to bring to your attention that dispute, because I need your opinion!

So, what do you guys think: would these kind of sounds be appealing nowadays, when they are not used anymore, or would they lose their former shine, just because they are not cool anymore today, when sampler is quaint and obsolete!

Waiting for anyone's input! The more they come, the more statistically significant they will be!

Let me notice as well, some difficult to be heard, like TIME record's FX sounds (Max Coveri-In the night etc). They added an unexpressed appealing along with the noise of the cable and analogue synths. Now with VST's, all are ''clean'' and loud....

No reply, excepting for Johnny's. Unbelievable!

danisberg
No reply, excepting for Johnny's. Unbelievable!

There is more than i expressed above. The transition from analogue tapes (when you get, what you hear) to digital (sample rate-segments of sounds) in addition with U-RAM-eater VSTs (Synths or effect-tape delay), means that, the songs will have the lack of that monster delays (tape or not)/Reverbs etc in the comparison with 70s/80s productions.

Dear Danisberg in my opinion, some samples/noise/FX could be used and would be like the old days, along with some Ohhh OhhhOhhh Ohhhh vocals (another thing that missing nowadays) on Chorus, depending from the arranger/producer.
I used some old tricks like those you mentioned in future releases. For sure, those samples/vocals etc, belongs to an era, it won't be repeated...

J.Papagiannis
Dear Danisberg in my opinion, some samples/noise/FX could be used and would be like the old days, along with some Ohhh OhhhOhhh Ohhhh vocals (another thing that missing nowadays) on Chorus, depending from the arranger/producer.
I used some old trucks like those you mentioned in future releases. For sure, those samples/vocals etc, belongs to an era, it won't be repeated...

Sorry to hear that, Johnny! But why, since we all like them so much?! Isn't it a barrier that we, ourselves, set?! A logic principle, called a fortiori principle, says that if one can do much, that one can also do less.

If we have a better technology, isn't it easier to use something that could be accessed in the past with so much effort?

I an interview with Mike Platinas and Toni Peret, who were part of the team which made the famous Max Mixes. They talked about cutting tapes and so on. And said that a Max Mix could take months to be made.

And the reporter asked: What about now? How long would it take? And Mike, I guess, replied: Half an hour. What we did back then in months would take half an hour now.

And I don't understand: what is this? Lack of creativity? Otherwise how should I explain that musicians made much better songs in the 80s, with a primitive technology and now, with advanced technology, not only they cannot, but the pressing plants cannot even come close to the great analogue sound from the 80s?! How come?

As far as i can understand, the easier we have access to cutting-edge technology, the harder it is for us to get our minds to work creatively.

Dan,

My response may not directly address your original question, but it relates to the direction this discussion has taken.

I really believe music meant a lot more back then than it does now. Even buying records—at $8 to $10 a pop—was a real commitment for the average high school or college student. And you had to hunt for them, especially imports, which weren’t readily available. Today, it’s just click-pay--listen-forget.

The ’80s were an incredibly creative time for dance music. Just consider how many new genres were born during that single decade: Boogie, New Wave, Synth-pop, Electro, Italo Funk, Italo Disco, Hip-Hop, Hi-NRG, Freestyle, EBM, New Beat, Chicago House, Garage House, Darkwave, Acid House, Detroit Techno, Euro-House, early Eurobeat… I’m sure I’m forgetting a few, but that’s just off the top of my head. All of that happened within just ten years (!).

And then there was the rise of DJ culture: from the long-play New York-style mixes of the ’70s to turntablism, Chicago’s Hot Mix, Italy’s Cosmic style, and the Megamix movement in the Netherlands. It was all new—innovative, bold, and truly fresh.

Here’s a fun thought experiment to carry this forward: what new has emerged in dance music from 1990 to today? My guess is, even if we try hard, we’ll only come up with about a third as much innovation.

I’ll start the list: Italodance, Deep House, Trance (with its endless subgenres), Downtempo/Ambient (the Enigma sound), Italo 2000, Chill-out, Dubstep, Electro-House… Please add more if anything comes to mind.

While DJ technology has absolutely exploded—making all kinds of creativity technically possible—it surprisingly hasn’t resulted in significant creative breakthroughs, at least not in of musical substance.

There’s just so much music and so many new artists available today… and so little time to really explore and connect with it. Like our old friend Johnny said earlier, "The ease of access doesn't often stimulate creativity." In theory, it should—but in practice, it's another story. Maybe we’ve hit a saturation point. Who knows?

As a side note (and I think it’s related), the buzz and ionate discussions on Italo Disco forums in the early 2000s? Compare that to today. Fans seem to care a lot less—because, frankly, it means a lot less.

I agree with you both!

Still, I wouldn't compare the discussions in the early 2000 with the apparent lack of interest of today, because back in those times, the collectors were less, the information sources were only a few, the internet was in its beginning, the social interaction was of much more substance than today - people really wanted to socialize, not to play stupid games on the phone...

Just my 2 cents on it!

Again, though, would you be enthusiasts for new interesting and weird sounds or would you just prefer flat italos, like the majority of (even if good, many of them) today italos?

Dear Dan let me explain my opinion. The majority of ''italodisco'' out there, are not traditional
Italodisco. Octave basses from trance synths as well as their pads , leads etc and kicks/snares from 90s eurodance era and lack of other percussion, sorry, are not Italodisco with the traditional definition.
I had a conversation with a guy, regarding on how to record back then with 4-track tapes.
He said that, firstly they recorded 4 basic drums such as kick/snare/hi hats & open hats. They added effects, then mixed them and set on the first channel of the tape. They continue with other sounds/synths etc with the same way. Reaching the max number of tape, mixing the synths with the first channel (all drums) & put all those on first channel again. On the other three free, continue to record the other synths/vocals etc, apply effect and mixed again with fist track that had the previous recordings. They continue with that way until the track is finished. They need days on studio for that and high amount of money, take for granted, the studios was rent hour by hour. Nowadays the guy is in charge for mixing, take all the channels (from 20-45 apox) once and try to apply effects and make mixing all together. That's why they start removing most of the time, significant noises that needs to be here, like percussions/claps etc, taking into that they work on PC (see above) we have a sterile mix. Back in the days, they don't worry if the effects and the whole mix sometimes (see: colloured rhymes) have all those fluctuations on sound generally.

J.Papagiannis
Dear Dan let me explain my opinion. The majority of ''italodisco'' out there, are not traditional
Italodisco. Octave basses from trance synths as well as their pads , leads etc and kicks/snares from 90s eurodance era and lack of other percussion, sorry, are not Italodisco with the traditional definition.
I had a conversation with a guy, regarding on how to record back then with 4-track tapes.
He said that, firstly they recorded 4 basic drums such as kick/snare/hi hats & open hats. They added effects, then mixed them and set on the first channel of the tape. They continue with other sounds/synths etc with the same way. Reaching the max number of tape, mixing the synths with the first channel (all drums) & put all those on first channel again. On the other three free, continue to record the other synths/vocals etc, apply effect and mixed again with fist track that had the previous recordings. They continue with that way until the track is finished. They need days on studio for that and high amount of money, take for granted, the studios was rent hour by hour. Nowadays the guy is in charge for mixing, take all the channels (from 20-45 apox) once and try to apply effects and make mixing all together. That's why they start removing most of the time, significant noises that needs to be here, like percussions/claps etc, taking into that they work on PC (see above) we have a sterile mix. Back in the days, they don't worry if the effects and the whole mix sometimes (see: colloured rhymes) have all those fluctuations on sound generally.

My friend, I understand as much as I, who am not in making music, could understand.

But my question was simpler: would people like that kind of italo or more predictable kind of italo?! I mean nowadays, 'cause I guess it's obvious for back in the days!

I expanded on the topic but i would like to share all those things that combined the magic things for making our beloved music,.Regarding your question, It depends. People appreciated too much songs like ''Lycan'' and they loved ELLA-In my mind, Dyva-On fire & Clap again, T. Rivale's 12'' during 00's, Mention, and much more, they have been arranged with classic italo sounds and wrote their own chapter on history book. Maybe arrangers (including me), think more skeptically, all those.

J.Papagiannis
As far as i can understand, the easier we have access to cutting-edge technology, the harder it is for us to get our minds to work creatively.

YES. It does seem to go like that. Pick any genre.

In 80s, most of SIAE stamped exported 12" records were 'italo disco'. The current definition of Italodisco (one version of which in use here) has been stated late 90s/21st century. Nowadays there too much those styles and genres for normal brains to be able categorize correctly. Is 80s electro italodisco ? Is 80s eurobeat italo disco ?

euromatlox
In 80s, most of SIAE stamped exported 12" records were 'italo disco'. The current definition of Italodisco (one version of which in use here) has been stated late 90s/21st century. Nowadays there too much those styles and genres for normal brains to be able categorize correctly. Is 80s electro italodisco ? Is 80s eurobeat italo disco ?

Are you sure you understood my question?!

As I see (other answers), none has fully understood it (given exact answer). But there's talk about 'classic italo sounds', and that's a thing not so clear to understand what it means. My opinion is that the songs you have listed represent classic italo disco (Video Kids perhaps is more euro disco), but I think that Aleph tracks are also classic part of italo disco history (some categorize Aleph into eurobeat). Tarzan's yelling is sure not classic italo disco, but of course as a sound effect it is very nice addition. Let's mention some more tracks with great sound effects.

Authokino - Cernobyl
Digital Emotion - Go Go Yellow Screen (italo disco?)
Gazebo - Telephone Mama
Radiorama - Hey Hey
Swan - General Custer

One bad thing about sound effects is that possible make live performance more difficult, but not sure anymore about that after I watched this performance of Paul Harcastle's 19.

euromatlox
As I see (other answers), none has fully understood it (given exact answer). But there's talk about 'classic italo sounds', and that's a thing not so clear to understand what it means. My opinion is that the songs you have listed represent classic italo disco (Video Kids perhaps is more euro disco), but I think that Aleph tracks are also classic part of italo disco history (some categorize Aleph into eurobeat). Tarzan's yelling is sure not classic italo disco, but of course as a sound effect it is very nice addition. Let's mention some more tracks with great sound effects.

Authokino - Cernobyl
Digital Emotion - Go Go Yellow Screen (italo disco?)
Gazebo - Telephone Mama
Radiorama - Hey Hey
Swan - General Custer

One bad thing about sound effects is that possible make live performance more difficult, but not sure anymore about that after I watched this performance of Paul Harcastle's 19.

Ok, again:

1. I didn't use the word "classic" in the first intervention. Not only once.

2. I asked why new italo song don't have that spark of genius like some of the old ones and whether those weird sounds used in them make or not the difference between sparkling memorable songs or boring ones.

THAT'S EVERYTHING I WANTED TO KNOW IN THE FIRST PLACE!

No need copy-paste previous content, makes it much harder to read.
I read also answers to the original post, I think they are also as valuable as the original. I have not stated the exact place where the word 'classic' appears, though you're right it's not in the beginning post.

About the second matter, I think nowadays most new stuff is at least a little bit copy-paste production, target is to sell and possibly gain some radio time (=make money). In the past producers did gamble more with releases, and I guess it was more economical to take risks. Another matter is education, in the past many actors were taken from the street, but nowadays they come from schools. I think this is also (at least partly) the situation in music business nowadays. It was also easier to switch doing something other than was educated for (like changing the style of music into Italo Disco for example).

Competion and production was very intense in the 80s. All new 'tricks' were welcome.
Nowadays production is for music videos, in the past main target was music (videos not so important part).

Correct, on one hand! I guess nowadays people try to imitate someone's style: Pegoraro, Cundari, Spagna, Farina, Margutti and so on! Back in the 80s, on the contrary, they tried to not be similar with anyone!

On the other hand, I guess lack of creativity nowadays has no excuse! Let's take for example Lady Gaga: she is the only music writer who still creates! Even if she has money as much as she wants, even if she is wealthy and in the spotlight and famous and has anything she wants! Did you hear her last song, How Bad Do You Want Me?! I am sure she doesn't know Yazoo - Only You, with which it resembles, and, if she doesn't know it, indeed, the song is a masterpiece! How come she can?!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lo-RqkSYoTU

Didn't know Gaga has new stuff, perhaps not 'Alejandro' level but really good. I think in the 80s music was not so categorized as it is now. 'Italo Disco' was more flexible containing songs that can (almost) sound different like night and day. Yes it's true that in the current times it's easier to copy ideas from someone else's repertoire and/or sound space.